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Old 13th September 2007, 04:16 PM   #1
Doug
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Default Is It Possible To Get Inbound Links Too Quickly?

If I generate too many inbound links in a short period of time could that result in a penalty. Eg) from zero to 500 in a week.

What would be an acceptable rate at which to acquire inbound links?

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Old 13th September 2007, 05:07 PM   #2
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Since the number of inbound links you get is largely out of your control, I can't imagine the SEs would penalize you simply based on the number of links. For instance, if a company gets profiled on the front page of the Wall Street Journal, or they get slashdotted or something, they're liable to not only get swamped with traffic, but also to pick up a whole bunch of links -- whether they want them or not.

For the SEs to penalize a site for something they can't control would be silly. If they did that, all you'd have to do to knock your competitors out of the game would be to submit their sites to a ton of free directories and FFA sites. There's no way the smart folks at places like Google and Yahoo are going to make it that easy for the dirty tricksters out there.

(I'm not saying there's no way for a competitor to hurt you through link submission -- I'm just saying they have to work a lot harder to pull it off than just submitting you to every crappy directory they find.)

Obviously, the SEs aren't going to tell anybody what an "acceptable rate" is -- or even if such a thing exists -- so any answers you get will simply be somebody's opinion.

That said, IMO, the acceptable rate is however many good quality links you can get. I feel fairly confident in saying the SEs will never penalize anybody for getting high-quality links, no matter how many of them they get or how fast.

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Old 14th September 2007, 03:51 PM   #3
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That makes sense

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Old 15th September 2007, 10:39 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by torka View Post
Since the number of inbound links you get is largely out of your control, I can't imagine the SEs would penalize you simply based on the number of links. For instance, if a company gets profiled on the front page of the Wall Street Journal, or they get slashdotted or something, they're liable to not only get swamped with traffic, but also to pick up a whole bunch of links -- whether they want them or not.

For the SEs to penalize a site for something they can't control would be silly. If they did that, all you'd have to do to knock your competitors out of the game would be to submit their sites to a ton of free directories and FFA sites. There's no way the smart folks at places like Google and Yahoo are going to make it that easy for the dirty tricksters out there.

Obviously, the SEs aren't going to tell anybody what an "acceptable rate" is -- or even if such a thing exists -- so any answers you get will simply be somebody's opinion.

That said, IMO, the acceptable rate is however many good quality links you can get. I feel fairly confident in saying the SEs will never penalize anybody for getting high-quality links, no matter how many of them they get or how fast.

My

--Torka
Torka,

I have a different viewpoint. Here is where I am coming from.

Google constantly indexes the web and has been doing so for a number of years now. So it makes sense that at one point or another, they analyzed inbound links as a function of time (plotted against some other parameters like if the links are from sites related to your site, etc.).

Then they probably found some sort of trend that said, 99.99% of the time if a website gets more than X inbound links within the first Y days they are up, then they are a spammy black hat SEO site (99.99% of the time or something like that). (im sure big companies are given more leeway in this department)

Aaron wall recently blogged about this:
http://www.seobook.com/3-ways-get-sc...edia-marketing

This counterintuitive viewpoint is justified by the following things about google:


1)google is very anti-Spamming google (much more so than other search engines)
2)google has been around for a while and has lots of time dependent data they can analyze.
3)google has a huge sample size of data about websites, and the bigger your sample size, the more solid your conclusions are (in general).


Its an interested question,
thanks for starting the thread!

Evan

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Last edited by solid28; 15th September 2007 at 10:42 AM.
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Old 15th September 2007, 11:17 AM   #5
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There are lots of paranoid Chicken Little SEO theories out there. Just because somebody claims the sky is falling, that doesn't make it true, though.

I'm suspicious of anybody who claims they know precisely what the cause was of any particular problem with rankings. Call me cynical, but I have a hard time believing that Google is going to confirm, even for Aaron, that somebody's site was "hand edited out" by a "senior Google engineer," as in his third example.

The second example was a problem with poor structuring of the offer such that every inbound link was also reciprocated with an outbound link. That has nothing to do with getting knocked down for getting links too quickly -- and everything to do with getting knocked down for presenting the profile of a site engaged in a spammy FFA "link to me and I'll link to you" campaign... possibly because that's what it sounds as though it was.

In the first example, frankly, I need more information. How does he know the pages don't pass PageRank? Did Google confirm for them this is true? How did he decide it was the "linkbait" that caused the issue? What has he done to rule out other causes? Have they filed a reinclusion request with Google? What was the result?

I mean, if he has enough inside contacts with Google to be able to state definitively that this page is no longer passing PageRank, and that another site's indexing was "hand-edited" by a "senior Google engineer," then surely he has sufficient contacts to be able to either pass along the word directly this is not a spammy site or to shepherd a reinclusion request successfully through the process. Assuming that everything was all on the up-and-up with the linkbait campaign to start with, of course.

I stand by what I said. No rational search engine is going to penalize a site for getting truly high quality links, no matter how many of them they get or how fast.

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Old 15th September 2007, 11:11 PM   #6
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Quote:
Then they probably found some sort of trend that said, 99.99% of the time if a website gets more than X inbound links within the first Y days they are up, then they are a spammy black hat SEO site (99.99% of the time or something like that). (im sure big companies are given more leeway in this department)
I would think (and hope) that it is a bit more sophisticated. It makes a lot of difference where the links come from. For instance, if I had some brilliant resource, of interest to most of the world, and was very PR savy when I launched my website, then I could probably get a significant number of permanent links quite rapidly, in addition to temporary (blogs etc) links. These links should be distinguishable from the farms. I can imagine that some forms of linkbaiting can easily look a bit like (and perhaps are) farming in the nature of the inbound links.

And to quote from the end of Aarom Wall blog entry referenced above;

Quote:
Linkbait can do a great job of helping you build high authority citations, but it still needs to be offset with directory links, community links, media links, and any other type of quality link you can get.
Though I have no idea how it works, I can quite easily imagine a series of weighted scores for various parameters to distinguish (most of the time) one from the other.

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Old 16th September 2007, 07:38 AM   #7
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Torka,

I came off way more extreme than I intended. I should have said that I agree with you in almost all cases, but there is also the "too many links too quickly" case to consider.

And I think its worth keeping in mind that google is really antispam, to the extent that they nuked their own blog...there was probably a ton of high quality links hitting that blog but it still got nuked. I think that case

Yeah you're right about aaron, if he can't give us names or quotes from "senior google engineers", then we don't have too much to go off of.



Jaairey,
I feel that was kind of a decontextualized quote...I ended the previous paragraph with "(plotted against some other parameters like if the links are from sites related to your site, etc.)"
But I'll be more clear next time, thanks for keeping me honest.

Small side note about sophistication of algorithm...I think the very first google algorithm just analyzed link profiles and saw who link to who. The algorithm has become much more complex these days!

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Old 16th September 2007, 11:20 AM   #8
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Regarding "they nuked their own blog" .... I enjoy David's writing, but I wouldn't consider there to be any proof that the adsense blog not being listed was a direct cause of too many links too quickly.

I believe time is a component of google's algorithm, but not on its own. The way I look at it is that time is one of many components that may provide a 'signal' to google. I agree with Torka's explanation, with an emphasis that she is specifically referring to high quality sites. If the links are from high quality sites, I wouldn't have any concern. If they are not, then time may be one of many signals that google considers. I don't think time is a factor on its own, and independent of many other variables.

Good work explaining things Torka

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Old 17th September 2007, 01:42 PM   #9
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I believe it's less about the number of sites and more about where they're coming from and what they say.

Lots of links with the majority coming from same site - not desirable

Lots of links from a wide variety of sites - good

Lots of links from a wide variety of sites in same/complementary industry - better

Lots of links from a wide variety of high PageRank sites in same or complementary industries - much better.

But

Lots of links from a wide variety of high PageRank sites in same or complimentary industries using your keyword anchors - BEST!

However...

If too many sites, regardless of the quality of the sites they sit on, using the same anchors pop up at the same time, you could be back to square one. The engines, especially G seem to be sensitive to anything that remotely looks like g-bombing and reacts fairly quickly. We've seen this frequently.

Bottom line?

Link slowly and thoughtfully across a wide range of sites in your field or those that touch your field. Mix up what you're anchors say and don't forget your URL is an anchor.

Don't stick to one type of linking method, use a bunch of different ones and run a couple simultaneouly. Hit them from all sides!

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Old 23rd September 2007, 05:45 PM   #10
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Gaining inbound links in the thousands per day will probably throw up spam flags. As far as I am aware the search engines look for strange behavior in link gaining velocity. So if the site was gaining a couple a month and then suddenly 5000 links flow in then nothing. That might alert them.

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