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hscpub
9th October 2004, 05:21 PM
Help. Our site, is brand new and has very little internet presence (I mean very little, close to zero). Need to hire SEO and not sure where to start, how to evaluate, etc. What are the price ranges typically for variouis types of services and how does one determine, as a beginner, what combination of SEO services are most needed (I went to one website and there seemed to be a sizable variety to choose from)? Thanks.

hscpub
9th October 2004, 05:24 PM
I forgot, I wanted to mention to the site administrator, I picked the forum topic (seo) that seemed to be most relevant, but if not best selection feel free to move post to most appropriate forum (belong to two forums and that is how they do things I think if needed) just please let us know. Thanks. Alex Hammer

Robert
9th October 2004, 08:21 PM
Welcome to the forum hscpub. We're glad you've joined us! :standingw

Things slow down a bit here on the weekend, but you are sure to get more responses on Monday.

I'd first take a look at the moderators here in our forum (listed in no particular order):

Moderator Name: David Wallace
Real Name: David Wallace
Website: http://www.searchrank.com/

Moderator Name: Logan
Real Name: Chris Logan
Website: http://www.beyondwebservices.com/

Moderator Name: Old Welsh Guy
Real Name: James Edwards
Website: http://www.umbrella-consultancy.co.uk/

I'm leaving Jennifer (thejenn) off the list simply because she will be going on maternity leave in the next couple of weeks or so. :)

You don't have to limit your choices to just those above, but they are people I have no problem recommending.

Here are some steps to walk through when reviewing a potential SEO:

1. Are they listed in one of the following SEO directories?:

SEOPros.org - http://www.seopros.org/
SEO Consultants Directory - http://www.seoconsultants.com/

I mention those two specifically because they don't list just anyone that applies. They have standards that have to be met.

2. Do they participate in SEO forums? Don't exclude someone because they don't, but if they do, spend the time reading through their posts. I mean read them all.

3. You need to spend a TON of time in the SEO forums yourself. The more you know about SEO, the better equiped you will be in hiring someone. Here are some to visit:

Cre8asite - http://www.cre8asiteforums.com/index.php
IHelpYou - http://www.ihelpyouservices.com/forums/
VP Forums (aka JimWorld) - http://www.jimworld.com/apps/webmaster.forums/
High Rankings - http://www.highrankings.com/forum/

Visit these after you've gotten your feet wet with the above:
Search Engine Watch - http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/index.php
Webmaster World - http://www.webmasterworld.com/

There are others, but these will keep you busy for a while.

4. Additionally you need to spend a TON of time reading articles at reputable search engine marketing sites. Two of my favorite:

Search Engine Guide - http://www.searchengineguide.com/
Search Engine Watch - http://searchenginewatch.com/

5. Ask for references - preferably old ones so you can check to see if they did anything to get past clients banned by the search engines.

6. Read these articles:

Look Before You Leap - What to Look For and Look Out For When Choosing an SEO/SEM Firm
http://www.searchengineguide.com/wallace/2004/0901_dw1.html

Outsourcing Search Engine Marketing
http://searchenginewatch.com/searchday/article.php/3324671

Selecting a Search Engine Optimization Company
http://www.searchengineguide.com/buresh/2003/0508_sb1.html

7. Do a search in the major search engines on the name of your SEO. Don't be surprised if you come across some negative items. What you are looking for is an overall trend - both positive or negative.

8. Don't rush! Hiring a bad SEO is far worse than not hiring one at all. You must spend the time to educate yourself before you hire anyone. I can't stress this point enough.

hscpub
9th October 2004, 08:28 PM
Robert, I am so impressed. Maybe my expectations are too low but that information alone that you provided is more help than I expected to get in total (obviously I underestimated the value this type of site). Thank you very very much. Alex

Robert
9th October 2004, 10:42 PM
I'm glad to help. I think you'll find that everyone is really friendly here and will help if they can. I just happened to see your message first. :)

wayne h
10th October 2004, 07:11 PM
Don't get too hasty in hiring an SEO firm.

After reading the various posts at the many SEO forums (but be careful as not all advice is even remotely created equal), you will at worst be able to ask the right questions.

You might even learn enough to do your own SEO. :)

Many other people on this forum offer free advice as well. You might be able to save some money, and learn SEO on your own. :thumbsup:

Oh....and start a blog for some really powerful increases in the search rankings. ;)

Wayne Hurlbert

Old Welsh Guy
11th October 2004, 07:04 AM
HI Alex, welcome. SEO is not rocket science, although on occassion it feels that way.

So long as your site is not in too competitive a field you should, given time be able to get decent rankings/traffic/results.

Hiring an SEO without having a basic understanding is really hit and miss IMO. The advice Robert has given above is good. Read up about it, learn at the very least, the basics, and then you should be able to make a decision based on known information rather than guesswork. Hey, chances are you might be able to do enough yourself. :)

<added>
Please don't take offence, but I just looked at your site. I think it needs a complete overhaul. I use a 21" monitor @1280x1024, and i got a huge sideways scroll to read the front page. The page is really a mess. I hate to say this as you are a new member, but really there is no easy way to say it, and doing otherwise would not help you in the least.

Old Welsh Guy
11th October 2004, 07:21 AM
Added again,

seoconsultants now charge $100 review charge for inclusion. this for me is reason enough not to get listed :) Personally I do not see $100 of benefit from it..

Robert
11th October 2004, 11:21 AM
OWG, thanks for updating me on seoconsultants. I didn't realize they charge now.

Don't exclude someone just because they aren't in the directories. Just be sure to do more homework on them.

Old Welsh Guy
11th October 2004, 12:38 PM
No problem. I understand why they are doing it though, as it costs money to run an organisation after all. Eventually we will all have a set of agreed standards to work within, and to be graded upon. Until that day we are going to have to keep walking on eggshells.

It is very difficult to work out how to chose an SEO these days, especially with the black hats getting sites banned etc. As you said, the only real way is to learn a little about the subject matter, and do some home work.

Chris
11th October 2004, 01:40 PM
Welcome hcspub.

I just visited your site after reading what welsh said and.. I would suggest that you do not waste any time at the moment with hiring an SEO and concentrate on redoing the whole website. Looking at the cost etc that you are charging here and there for adspace it would be well worth an investment in your online website to have a professionally designed internet website. A badly designed site will drive visitors away faster than anything. If they have to scroll left and right they will leave. If they have to squint to see images they will leave. You get the idea :)

If I can be of any help feel free to contact me.

deepak
12th October 2004, 11:38 PM
Hi..

I browsed your site and as mentioned by others..you need to redo it so that's its SEO friendly and then work on the SEO part..

I have my own company and I do SEO and web designing..If you need I can surely help you..
Let me know.

Cheers
Deepak

StupidScript
15th October 2004, 05:28 PM
Welcome aboard, Alex!

Just chiming in in support of a site redesign. Your designer must use a widescreen highres monitor! :)

Try to keep the maximum page width between 720 pixels and 900 pixels. Heck, your primary image is almost 1200 pixels, all by itself, with a 1200 pixel table cell right beside it.

Anyway ... a site redesign followed by SEO should be your order of business.

Robert
8th November 2004, 05:20 PM
Another good source for your research:

KeywordRanking's 20 Questions to Ask All SEO Providers

http://www.keywordranking.com/SEO-best-practices.cfm

"20 questions to protect and assist those considering SEO services. The answers to these questions will give insight into the skill and competency of an SEO firm and allow website owners to make informed decisions when selecting providers."

copywriter
9th November 2004, 09:56 AM
If you need help with SEO Copywriting, Alex, you can find lots of free copywriting articles (http://www.marketingwords.com/articles.html) on my site and in the archives of my newsletter (http://www.marketingwords.com/ezinearchive.html).

You can also ask any questions you have about SEO copywriting here.

Karon

madcat_
24th November 2004, 11:08 AM
Guys

I know m new here.... and all those guys are SEO experts already so I wouldn't give anymore advice on how to pick SEO firms (sometimes just one person)

what matters however are your sales... not simply the traffic driven to your site.
So have some sort of tracking script running all over your page (especially on your signup script) So If ever you make a decision to get SEO consulting. keep close track of your number. not just your hits but the actual conversion from your hits.

having 1M more hits generating 2-3 more sales on a small item might be a loss if it wont even cover your SEO (additional overhead)

After you have spent tons of hours (which is same to loss in opportunities) researching make sure you have a way to change consultants. In case things don't turn out so well.

:thumbsup:

Old Welsh Guy
8th December 2004, 04:51 AM
Madcat, That is so right. A good SEO will carry out a complete site review, and should be able to increase sales without increasing traffic due to increased conversions. Change of copy, better navigation, more prominent calls to action general usability etc . All of these things will impact on conversion of traffic, and if your SEO is not talking about this, then they are probably not really up on the game, and still in the dark days of 'ranking is king'.

wayne h
16th December 2004, 12:48 AM
Madcat, That is so right. A good SEO will carry out a complete site review, and should be able to increase sales without increasing traffic due to increased conversions. Change of copy, better navigation, more prominent calls to action general usability etc . All of these things will impact on conversion of traffic, and if your SEO is not talking about this, then they are probably not really up on the game, and still in the dark days of 'ranking is king'.

I agree with this completely.

I talk to my clients about SEO, marketing, and conversions as all being part of the package I offer. If any of the puzzle pieces are missing, the others aren't anywhere nearly as effective.

Being at the top of the search rankings is of little value if none of the visitor traffic converts to paying customers or clients. ;)

Wayne Hurlbert

AvniShergill
9th April 2014, 03:04 AM
Welcome to the forum hscpub. We're glad you've joined us! :standingw

Things slow down a bit here on the weekend, but you are sure to get more responses on Monday.

I'd first take a look at the moderators here in our forum (listed in no particular order):

Moderator Name: David Wallace
Real Name: David Wallace
Website: http://www.searchrank.com/

Moderator Name: Logan
Real Name: Chris Logan
Website: http://www.beyondwebservices.com/

Moderator Name: Old Welsh Guy
Real Name: James Edwards
Website: http://www.umbrella-consultancy.co.uk/

I'm leaving Jennifer (thejenn) off the list simply because she will be going on maternity leave in the next couple of weeks or so. :)

You don't have to limit your choices to just those above, but they are people I have no problem recommending.

Here are some steps to walk through when reviewing a potential SEO:

1. Are they listed in one of the following SEO directories?:

SEOPros.org - http://www.seopros.org/
SEO Consultants Directory - http://www.seoconsultants.com/

I mention those two specifically because they don't list just anyone that applies. They have standards that have to be met.

2. Do they participate in SEO forums? Don't exclude someone because they don't, but if they do, spend the time reading through their posts. I mean read them all.

3. You need to spend a TON of time in the SEO forums yourself. The more you know about SEO, the better equiped you will be in hiring someone. Here are some to visit:

Cre8asite - http://www.cre8asiteforums.com/index.php
IHelpYou - http://www.ihelpyouservices.com/forums/
VP Forums (aka JimWorld) - http://www.jimworld.com/apps/webmaster.forums/
High Rankings - http://www.highrankings.com/forum/

Visit these after you've gotten your feet wet with the above:
Search Engine Watch - http://forums.searchenginewatch.com/index.php
Webmaster World - http://www.webmasterworld.com/

There are others, but these will keep you busy for a while.

4. Additionally you need to spend a TON of time reading articles at reputable search engine marketing sites. Two of my favorite:

Search Engine Guide - http://www.searchengineguide.com/
Search Engine Watch - http://searchenginewatch.com/

5. Ask for references - preferably old ones so you can check to see if they did anything to get past clients banned by the search engines.

6. Read these articles:

Look Before You Leap - What to Look For and Look Out For When Choosing an SEO/SEM Firm
http://www.searchengineguide.com/wallace/2004/0901_dw1.html

Outsourcing Search Engine Marketing
http://searchenginewatch.com/searchday/article.php/3324671

Selecting a Search Engine Optimization Company
http://www.searchengineguide.com/buresh/2003/0508_sb1.html

7. Do a search in the major search engines on the name of your SEO. Don't be surprised if you come across some negative items. What you are looking for is an overall trend - both positive or negative.

8. Don't rush! Hiring a bad SEO is far worse than not hiring one at all. You must spend the time to educate yourself before you hire anyone. I can't stress this point enough.

Even I was looking for some quality of the resource on the same topic, thanks for your guidance.

SBElec
9th April 2014, 07:20 AM
If you're likely to only want the work done for a short amount of time then why don't you look for a freelancer? Just be a little cautious that those with the smallest fees may do the riskiest work!

CooperJay
15th April 2014, 09:20 AM
Thanks for all the insight at this. I was wondering some of the same stuff myself. I am looking to get my own site started and I knew making the site is one thing, but getting results that I want and need from it is a completely different matter.